| speakers [message #18521] |
Tue, 26 March 2013 07:40  |
stevem
Messages: 4773
Registered: June 2004
Location: NY
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Senior Member |
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Can any one of you fellow Kustom nuts comfirm for me that Kustom K100 amps( combo type or non) used a 16 ohm driver?
Thanks in advance!
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| Re: speakers [message #18533 is a reply to message #18532] |
Wed, 27 March 2013 11:11  |
Kustom_Bart
Messages: 601
Registered: October 2010
Location: Greenville, MichiGUN
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It still would have been a 16ohm speaker if I remember the conversation that Pleat and me had correctly. In that era they used 16ohm speakers for everything, even some in the K50's and K25's. I personally have never owned one, but have heard of them. Maybe at that point they were buying what ever they could at the cheapest price and using them or using up whatever they had the most of on hand too.
If it were me I would put in the 8ohm to get the power from the amp and you sure aren't going to hurt it.
[Updated on: Wed, 27 March 2013 11:13] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: speakers [message #18537 is a reply to message #18536] |
Wed, 27 March 2013 16:25 |
pleat
Messages: 1454
Registered: June 2004
Location: Belding, Mi
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Senior Member |
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I think we need some clarification as to what amps and cabs we are talking about.
The 100 SC (series self contained amp and speakers in one case) are the SC series.
The 100 SC series later changed to the 150 SC series.
The K100-1 head and K100-2 heads came with a separate speaker cabinet, and was offered with 2x12 or the 1x15 speaker cabinet with different brand speaker options.
According to amps I've owned, and literature and dealer service copies I have.
The K100 SC 2x10 amp is the oddball amp, that used 8 ohm speakers wired in series for a 16 ohm load and literature shows it is a 50 watt peak power amp and included a speaker out jack on the back panel. Kustom did this to prevent amp failure when using a second speaker cabinet.
This may have been a short lived amp, as I've owned some without the extra speaker output jack and the speakers in those amps had 16 ohm speakers wired in parallel for 8 ohms to the amp.
The K100 SC 2x12 used 16 ohm speakers wired in parallel for 8 ohms, both in the standard Jensen and Altec 417 speaker versions.
The K100 SC 1x15 amp used an 8 ohm speaker, both in the CTS and Altec 421 speaker option.
The K25 and K50 SC amp used a single 16 ohm speaker Jensen speaker. I've owned several of these amps that have came to me both ways, with original Jensen 8 or 16 ohm speakers. More 16 ohm speakers in the K25 than the K50 amps.
Moving to the K100-1 and K100-2 piggyback amps.
Two versions of the head. 60 watt rms into a 8 ohm load.
K100-1 straight bright/ normal two channel head.
K100-2 single bright channel with reverb and vibrato.
Cabinets offered in two versions, the 2x12 cabinet and the single 1x15 cabinet.
2x12 cabinets speaker options are:
Jensen brand 16 ohms wired for 8 ohm load.
CTS brand 16 ohm wired for 8 ohm load.
Altec 417 brand 16 ohm wired for 8 ohm load.
Kustom did not offer the 2x12 cabinet with the JBL D120F speakers.
The 1x15 cabinets offered:
JBL D130F brand single 15" 16 ohm.
JBL D140F brand single 15" 16 ohm.
CTS brand single 15" 16 ohm.
Altec brand 418 15" 16 ohm.
Altec brand 421AB 8 ohm.
Jensen brand P15L 16 ohm. This is where it gets interesting.
Altec 418 1x15" is not listed in any dealer service literature as to the impedance. I am assuming it will be a 16 ohm as Kustom was offering the 418 in several 2x15 and 3x15 cabs along with the 3x15 siren PA cabs.
In the 69/70 big catalog with the supplemental pages. The 1x15 cab is shown with Altec 421AB that is sitting under the K100-1 head. That page shows a K200 head sitting on a 2x15 Altec 421AB cab. The page also shows the K400 head but with only two cabinets.
Knowing that the K400 head was offered in the main catalog with four cabs in the standard 418 altec cabs, I'd say any of the kustom cabs that were offered with the 421AB Altec speakers, the 1x15 and 2x15 cabs, those speakers would be 8 ohms each.
pleat
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| Re: speakers [message #18544 is a reply to message #18543] |
Thu, 28 March 2013 09:44 |
C4ster
Messages: 686
Registered: June 2001
Location: Mukwonago, WI (Milwaukee...
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Senior Member |
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Steve,
I bought 2 1x15 cabinets with CTS 15" speakers. Each was 16 ohms. I replaced those with 8 ohm JBL E140's.
Conrad
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| Re: speakers [message #18556 is a reply to message #18521] |
Fri, 29 March 2013 07:38 |
stevem
Messages: 4773
Registered: June 2004
Location: NY
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Senior Member |
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Well may be we can hear from more owners of the single 15 cab even cabinets and get a better grasp as to them being fitted with, or without question with 16 drivers.
I just do not understand why Kustom would by intent make the K100 output less wattage than even a Fender Bassman amp of the day, or their near rival Acoustic control!
I got a cabinet that had 5 fishing lours in it stuck to the lower speakers magnet ( no speaker cone damage), and a big ass spoon! Some mom is probibly wondering to this day where her best large size serving spoon got off to, and some person who was a small kid back when is still glad the they did not get found out and get their little fanny smaked!!
[Updated on: Fri, 29 March 2013 07:39] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: speakers [message #18595 is a reply to message #18521] |
Mon, 01 April 2013 10:03 |
conductortom
Messages: 96
Registered: July 2010
Location: Okla
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I have 3 1-15 cabs and all have 8 ohm speakers in them. Altec 421's and Jensen's. I have 4 2-12 cabs and they all had 16 ohm speakers.
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| Re: speakers [message #18603 is a reply to message #18521] |
Tue, 02 April 2013 12:49 |
conductortom
Messages: 96
Registered: July 2010
Location: Okla
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Member |
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Pleat,
2 of the cabs had jensen's, when I got them. I replaced them with the Altec 421's. I don't remember if they were stamped Kustom or not. I will check as soon as I get back home. The 3td cab had a speaker in it, that had been replaced as warrenty work in 84. On back of speaker, someone had written, that it was replaced under warrenty. I don't know what kind it is. It has a hard plastic frame. ?? It also had a choke screwed in on the inside of cab, but was not hooked up. Don't have a clue what it was used for. But all speakers were 8 ohm.
As far as the ports, I will check them too and let you know.
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| Re: speakers [message #18610 is a reply to message #18521] |
Thu, 04 April 2013 17:00 |
conductortom
Messages: 96
Registered: July 2010
Location: Okla
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Member |
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Pleat,
Checked cabs and they are all chrome port. One had a Jensen in it and the one I got from Terry had a stock CTS in it. The other had the warranty speaker in it and I'm not sure what it is. All are 8 ohm, 15" speakers. Replaced 2 with Altec 421's and still have the Jensen in last one. I couldn't see a Kustom stamp on them.
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| Re: speakers [message #18625 is a reply to message #18624] |
Mon, 08 April 2013 20:27 |
rodak
Messages: 516
Registered: October 2001
Location: Georgia
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Senior Member |
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12 ohm speakers? whoa!
That would have made a lot of sense for the 3x15 cabs, wouldn't it? 3x12 ohm in parallel would be 4 ohms right?
www.combo-organ.com
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| Re: speakers [message #18629 is a reply to message #18521] |
Tue, 09 April 2013 09:52 |
rodak
Messages: 516
Registered: October 2001
Location: Georgia
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Senior Member |
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Well, that I can kind of see - doing so, you'd have one speaker (the 8 ohm) carrying half the power, and the other two 25% each - probably not the best situation. I think probably the ideal arrangement would be to have two 3x15 cabinets, each loaded with two 15" speakers (16 ohms, parallel for a total of 8 ohms) and one HF horn, both fed by one K200 head. That way you'd have:
a) A 4 ohm load presented to the amp, for maximum power output
b) Two HF horns, for great highs
c) A better match of cabinet volume to the speakers. I understand that a 3x15 cabinet really does not have enough internal volume to allow 3 15" speakers to develop all the low-end they're capable of.
Of course, two 3x15 cabs look way cooler than one anyway.
www.combo-organ.com
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| Re: speakers [message #18641 is a reply to message #18521] |
Wed, 10 April 2013 16:06 |
rodak
Messages: 516
Registered: October 2001
Location: Georgia
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Senior Member |
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Yes, but the HF driver only presens a load at the higher frequencies, so at the lower freqs, where the power amp works hardest, and output power is greatest, it would only see 8 ohms, right?
So, yeah, while technically, hooking two 3x15 cabs with horns to a single K200 could potentially present a 2.8 ohm load, it would only be at the higher frequencies, where the amp is much more likely to tolerate it, and where the power output wouldn't be as great anyway. At least, in my experience, the impedance of a horn (with a passive crossover, of course)is almost never factored in when figuring the load presented to the amp.
What crossover frequency is used for the horn in a 3x15 cab, anyway? (or what size cap is used?)
www.combo-organ.com
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| Re: speakers [message #18642 is a reply to message #18641] |
Wed, 10 April 2013 17:06 |
Kustom_Bart
Messages: 601
Registered: October 2010
Location: Greenville, MichiGUN
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Senior Member |
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You are correct, the horn should not be factored in at all. Only the 15" drivers so it would be an eight ohm cab. I have 4 of them and that is how they ring out on a meter as well. So, you can run 2 of them with a K200 or 4 of them with my K400  But, you'll put someone's eye or ear out!
[Updated on: Wed, 10 April 2013 17:08] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: speakers [message #18643 is a reply to message #18641] |
Wed, 10 April 2013 17:58 |
pleat
Messages: 1454
Registered: June 2004
Location: Belding, Mi
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Senior Member |
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Kustom didn't offer two 3x15 cabs with a single K200 head in the guitar and bass amps. Kustom did offer the two 3x15 siren cabs in the PA version. Since your right as the frequency goes down, the horns are not that much of the load. I have seen most of the siren cabs with a 4MF cap in series with the horn driver, which would cross it around 2500Hz. I also have siren cabs and the newer 215+H horn cabs with 10MF caps that would cross around 1KHz. Since the original 3x15 siren K200-5 PA system was designed for vocals only, I wouldn't think the program material ever put a huge demand on the power amp.
pleat
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