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Missing pedals for K250-4 [message #4437]

Wed, 07 July 2004 16:20

fieldflower
Messages: 71
Registered: July 2004
Location: Sweden

Member

Hi,
I just drove my "new" K250-4 amp and 2x15 cabinet home today and I'm thrilled with the sound and everything, but there were no pedals...
- Are there any replacement pedals out there that are more or less 'plug-and-play' or...
- Does anyone here have specifications on the pedals for trem, vibrato, reverb, fuzz and Wah-wah for the K250-4.
I guess I will start taking this thing apart anytime soon, but especially the wah-wah pedal feels bad to trial-and-error my way forward, particularily so as I guess the 'error' in trial-and-error probably would happen inside the amp... Sad

Sad

Great to be another Kustom owner and fan, and great to find this place for information and other Kustomees..

BR from Sweden

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Re: Missing pedals for K250-4 [message #4464 is a reply to message #4437]

Fri, 09 July 2004 09:46

pleat
Messages: 1454
Registered: June 2004
Location: Belding, Mi

Senior Member

fieldflower, I have a shematic for the pedal. I tried to email it to you, but your email sent me to a website I can't read.
Don

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Re: Missing pedals for K250-4 [message #4465 is a reply to message #4464]

Fri, 09 July 2004 10:05

fieldflower
Messages: 71
Registered: July 2004
Location: Sweden

Member

Hi,

I guess You ended up on my bands homepage... (Daves deli?)
If You click the British flag You get the english version.

My email adress is: peter.akerblom@comhem.se

Do You have the schematics also for the boost pedal?

The 4-switch pedal I have more or less figured out how it must work (Sleeve = common, tip and ring one effect each, open=on, closed=off).

The boost pedal though is a mystery to me (but I want it badly...;o)
If I could find out schematics for it I could maybe build a substitute until I get hold of an original pedal.

Thanks in advance, Peter

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Re: Missing pedals for K250-4 [message #4468 is a reply to message #4465]

Sat, 10 July 2004 12:38

pleat
Messages: 1454
Registered: June 2004
Location: Belding, Mi

Senior Member

Hi, there should be a XLR multi pin jack in the back, that is for connecting the 4 button lighted footswitch. The Tip Ring Sleeve jack is for the boost or (wah) pedal. Kustom made two wah pedals, the first being a bigger one that is spring loaded, and the second generation pedal smaller in width. Both housings were used for the K250 amps and kombo 2 organ, but the spring loaded pedals were not used for the organ.
The pedal itself is no more than a volume pot inside, no other electronic parts. With the boost switch activated, the pedal would sweep through the 7 position boost tones to creat a wah effect. I think it was a 10K ohm pot inside the pedal. I'll have to see if I have a schematic for the boost pedal.
Don

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Re: Missing pedals for K250-4 [message #4469 is a reply to message #4468]

Sat, 10 July 2004 14:06

fieldflower
Messages: 71
Registered: July 2004
Location: Sweden

Member

Hi Don,

Thanks for the schematics on the pedal!

I actually have 3 tip-ring-sleeve jacks with (original I think) markings:
1: Reverb - Tremolo
2: Fuzz - Boost
3: Boost pedal

Since the jacks are not "disconnecting" (I don't know what it's called but I mean like the input jacks that are disconnected if there's no plug in them) I wonder if the resistors are really necessary... After all having no plug in the jack should be the same as having the pedal with no resistors, right?

I am almost done building a cheesy substitute pedal for 2 effects.
If this little experiment works I will add 2 more switches to operate all 4 effects.
I'm missing 2 switches at the moment to make it 4-switch, but I can change jack for now if this works out...

A spec on the pot would be great - if I know what pot to get I can start drawing on how to build a (also cheesy - but working..?) Wah-wah pedal.

I guess I need to know if the pot is linear or not as well...
Or just buy 2 and throw away the one that doesn't do the trick...
If You know this as well I'm more than grateful for the info.

BR, Pete

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Re: Missing pedals for K250-4 [message #4470 is a reply to message #4464]

Sat, 10 July 2004 21:26

VinceG2
Messages: 26
Registered: April 2004

Junior Member

pleat, can you send me the schematics to the pedal in email as well? You can send it here: vinceg2@yahoo.com

I'd sure love a copy! Thanks!

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Re: Missing pedals for K250-4 [message #4471 is a reply to message #4469]

Sun, 11 July 2004 12:03

pleat
Messages: 1454
Registered: June 2004
Location: Belding, Mi

Senior Member

Pete, it sounds like the jacks you describe are not original, with the exception of maybe the boost pedal jack which would be a tip/ring/sleeve. Original markings would have been a black washer around the jack with etched lettering. I sold kustom amps in the 60's and 70's and I never saw a kustom with three jacks like you describe. Kustom in the 250 series made only three models, the #1 head would be two channels, the #2 head added reverb/trem/vibrato and the #4 head added selective boost and fuzz along with reverb and trem. We never sold a #2 head but I know that head still used the multi 6 pin XLR plug to a two button lighted footswitch. I do have a picture of that pedal showing the XLR plug on the cord. There should be evidence of a the XLR jack on the back about center of the amp and towards the bottom. It may have been removed but a 3/4 to 7/8 diameter hole should be there.
The diodes and resistors in the pedal were used for the lights. You can make a footswitch that doesn't require the diodes and resistors, but you have to make sure the red voltage wire isn't invloved.
Don

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Re: Missing pedals for K250-4 [message #4472 is a reply to message #4470]

Sun, 11 July 2004 12:09

pleat
Messages: 1454
Registered: June 2004
Location: Belding, Mi

Senior Member

Done deal. Now if I could figure out how to attach it on the site, I can post it in a BMP format, any help out there?
Don

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Re: Missing pedals for K250-4 [message #4473 is a reply to message #4472]

Sun, 11 July 2004 13:33

fieldflower
Messages: 71
Registered: July 2004
Location: Sweden

Member

Hi,

My head is a #4 (with the fuzz and boost).

I took some photos (using my phone, so not so good quality) of the rear panel.
The jacks and jack plates look very original, but could You have a look?

First the full rear view (just to see where the jacks are located): http://www.davesdeli.se/fieldflower/Kustom250_rear_view.jpg

From left to right there are 2 fuses, then these two jacks for tremolo/reverb and fuzz/boost:
http://www.davesdeli.se/fieldflower/Kustom250_trem_verb_fuzz _boost.jpg

The next three jacks are boost pedal, output and tape recorder:
http://www.davesdeli.se/fieldflower/Kustom250_boost_out_tape .jpg

Not depicted is a power switch (maybe part of the rebuild for swedish 230V), another fuse and the power module output.

I did not find any additional holes (or mysterious cover plates) in the rear where the XLR jack could have been.
All the tip-ring-sleeve jacks have fitting holes.

What do You think about these mysterious effect pedal jacks.
If they aren't original someone has really put in some work in making those marking washers look like they were original...
I've had this thing apart and handled each of the washers and they really look and feel the same.

I built my cheesy pedal and the thing works.
I think I'll skip the diodes and resistors - I've put more thought into function than looks, and changing direction now wouldn't be easy (that is - it looks horrible beyond repair, but works fine..;o)
With my jacks there is no voltage wire to be aware of, just one lead for each effect, with return back to sleeve (= chassis).

Have You had any luck in finding schematics for the boost pedal?

BR, Pete

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Re: Missing pedals for K250-4 [message #4475 is a reply to message #4473]

Sun, 11 July 2004 18:13

pleat
Messages: 1454
Registered: June 2004
Location: Belding, Mi

Senior Member

Pete, you do have a rare amp. The jacks are using the same washer type lettering that kustom used. The two fuse holders on the back are not standard kustom issue on amps used in the states. The only thing I can figure is if your amp is a original export model, would maybe explain the fuses. The jacks are still the mystery. As long as you have made up a footswitch that works, I guess I wouldn't worry about it. I did look for a schematic for the wah pedal and only found a assembly drawing of it. No mention of values and type of pot used in it. Your amp might be a standard issue export model and we in the states wouldn't have had seen it. Wish I could have been more help.
Don

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Re: Missing pedals for K250-4 [message #4476 is a reply to message #4475]

Sun, 11 July 2004 18:49

fieldflower
Messages: 71
Registered: July 2004
Location: Sweden

Member

Hi Don,
I think You may be right. There is a sticker covering the S/N plate on the rear that might just be the original import sticker.
It has the music stores name (long gone and no trace of it on the web), model number, serial number and a swedish electrical approval logo on it.
That could indicate it was sold new in Sweden...
If the sticker had come along later in time I don't believe they would have written the serial number on it - the sticker is actually partly covering the original serial number plate...;o)
It's all guesses, but it makes sense...

I'll search for original boost and 4-switch pedals, but maybe I'll have to rebuild the 4-switch (bypass the diods - sigh!).

The assembly drawing might just come in handy for building a substitute pedal - could You mail it to me? I'd be most grateful!

Do You have any best guess what component I could start trial-and-erroring with for the boost pedal?
Would the 10K pot be a good starting point?

But wait a minute... if there is only one pot on the inside of the boost pedal... then if I could find someone who has one and is willing to try it with a mulitimeter the end values of the pot should be relatively easy to measure.
And whether it's a log or lin pot... I can buy 2 and use the one that sounds right..

Your help and advise is greatly appreciated.
I just hate not knowing what I have when it comes to vintage gear - and now I know more about this one than I know of my contemporary gear... A sign of interest I guess...

BR, Pete

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Re: Missing pedals for K250-4 [message #4480 is a reply to message #4476]

Mon, 12 July 2004 08:42

VinceG2
Messages: 26
Registered: April 2004

Junior Member

Don, thanks for the schematics!

Pete, if you look at here:

http://www.vintagekustom.com/images/newlit/150250500//08.jpg

You can see the pedals used for the K250-4.

I also see this version of a old Kustom pedal on ebay from time to time (top pedal shown)..no idea which model amp it is for:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=4 3373&item=3733701819&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

However, I don't know which of the two connectors shown on that auction is for which pedal.

I only have a K250-2, and on the back of my amp, is an XLR jack that has 4 pins (I think, trying to remember offhand.). The K250-2 only has Vibrato/Tremelo and Reverb, no wah or boost.

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Re: Missing pedals for K250-4 [message #4481 is a reply to message #4437]

Mon, 12 July 2004 09:06

VinceG2
Messages: 26
Registered: April 2004

Junior Member

Don, you mentioned having a picture showing the pedal for the #2 K250? Can you send me that as well?

The thing is, my XLR connector does not have 6 pins, but rather only 4 pins.

From talking with Les, we had determined that my amp was probably from the first batch of K250s made.
I'm assuming that if this is true, then there are subtle differences from the first batch, then what became standard.

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Re: Missing pedals for K250-4 [message #4483 is a reply to message #4481]

Mon, 12 July 2004 10:44

KustomBlues
Messages: 494
Registered: June 2001
Location: Michigan

Senior Member

All the 250's jacks I've seen have been 4 pin......

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Re: Missing pedals for K250-4 [message #4486 is a reply to message #4480]

Mon, 12 July 2004 21:52

pleat
Messages: 1454
Registered: June 2004
Location: Belding, Mi

Senior Member

The kustom pedal on ebay is for the valve tube series kustom produced in the late 70's early 80's.
The K250-2 heads with 4 pins make sense. a pin for each effect, and a + and ground for the lights in the switch. I just repaired a 4 button switch and it had 6 pins. One pin for each effect plus 1 for the voltage and 1 for the ground= 6 pins.
Vince, I can send you a picture of the two button lighted switch, I just need a email address. I also have a original 2 button round kustom footswitch with multi pin XLR plug that was used on the K200A series amps. The K200B series had the tip ring sleeve footswitch jack on the front panel and depending on what effects the amp came with one dual button footswitch or two dual button footswitches to control all the effects of the #4 head.
Don

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Re: Missing pedals for K250-4 [message #4488 is a reply to message #4486]

Tue, 13 July 2004 00:51

VinceG2
Messages: 26
Registered: April 2004

Junior Member

Don,

Thanks to seeing the schematic you sent, and going by the connector here from what I understand, the 4 pin XLR connector pinout would be:

1 - black - ground
2 - red - power
3 - brownish - Trem-Vib
4 - gray - reverb

Going by the schematic you sent, pins 1-4 would be the same, except that the white wire (listed as pin 3) would probably be the brownish wire here, and the green wire (pin 4) would be the gray wire here. I'm guessing gray then is reverb and brownish is Tremolo-Vibrato. Huh..I had always wrongly assumed that tremolo and vibrato had seperate on/off switches. Learn something new everyday!

BTW, do you know what the voltage for the lamp would be? I guess I could get the meter out and test the voltage between pins 1/2, just wondered.

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Re: Missing pedals for K250-4 [message #4493 is a reply to message #4488]

Tue, 13 July 2004 11:40

chicagobill
Messages: 2006
Registered: April 2003

Senior Member

Vince:
I fixed a four pedal unit a few months ago, and it used the same #335 lamps as are used in the power and polarity switch. So the lamps are rated at 28 volts. Bill

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Re: Missing pedals for K250-4 [message #4498 is a reply to message #4493]

Wed, 14 July 2004 03:30

VinceG2
Messages: 26
Registered: April 2004

Junior Member

Bill, thanks for the info.

Vince

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