Ultimate Kustom T&R Bass Rig? [message #8257] |
Wed, 14 February 2007 16:38 ![Go to next message Go to next message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/down.png) |
daveobergoenner@gmail.com
Messages: 104 Registered: January 2007 Location: Missouri
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Just daydreaming for a minute or two...
I’m a fan of DEEP bass tone...no 4-10 cabinets thank you. I prefer to hear the real fundamentals...not just harmonics. Give me real bass speakers, and a real amp to drive them.
Thinking about assembling the ultimate Kustom tuck and roll bass rig (within reason...so it will still fit in one vehicle).
Here’s my thoughts...
K-400 head (or maybe two, K200's, since I have one already)...for a solid, clean 200 watts of RMS power.
Two, 2-15 inch speaker cabinets.
Each cabinet loaded with two JBL E140-8 speakers, for a total load of 4 ohms for each side of the head (to get the most available power from the K-400 head).
I know the E140 wasn’t available when these amps were built, but they are 3db more efficient than the D140 was, and I do have 4 of them that match.
All this covered in some matching Zodiac Naugahyde sparkle of some kind...so as to be a thing of beauty for the eyes, as well as the ears.
I’m thinking this would pretty-much shake the house down.
What do you guys think?
Dave O.
Dave 0 Wall-O-Bass
Webpage - <a href="http://webpages.charter.net/daveobieone/" target="_blank">http://webpages.charter.net/daveobieone/</a >
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Re: Ultimate Kustom T&R Bass Rig? [message #8260 is a reply to message #8257] |
Thu, 15 February 2007 07:08 ![Go to previous message Go to previous message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/up.png) ![Go to next message Go to next message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/down.png) |
stevem
Messages: 4772 Registered: June 2004 Location: NY
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It depends if you want to have or build/ mod something.
I have one of the late 90`s Kustom trb400 models, its the size of a k200 but deeper, 2 channels one with a tube first stage and one just stright SS. its got a 6 band EQ section a contur control on each channel to sweep the overall range of EQ you have set,plus its got a built in adj crossover, preamp/power amp in and outs, and a foot switch to go from channel to channel.
Oh! and its 400 watts RMS at 4 ohms, fan cooled.You can get any sound out of it you like.
Its build quality chassie wise in not as good as the early stuff, but so far I have had no problems, and realy a simple but easy upgrade would be to drill out the threaded screw holes and install #8 machine bolts that with loctie.
The other thing you could do would be to make you own high wattage mosfet output section for one of your k200s.
their is plenty of room in there for a nice torodial PT putting out 80 volts for the powersupply rails, and plenty of room for a back to back heat sink assy, some things might have to be mounted on standoffs and you could get a small low current PT and use the original recto bridge to provide the 8 volts plus and minus for the preamp section.
Sounds like a fun winter project to me!?
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Re: Ultimate Kustom T&R Bass Rig? [message #8262 is a reply to message #8261] |
Thu, 15 February 2007 09:54 ![Go to previous message Go to previous message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/up.png) ![Go to next message Go to next message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/down.png) |
C4ster
Messages: 686 Registered: June 2001 Location: Mukwonago, WI (Milwaukee...
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Unfortunately I no longer have the pictures, but my son used a pair of siren cabinets with E140's and horns connected to a QSC PLX1602 power amp driven with a K200 all in Cascade. Not the QSC. The sound guy just gave up. The PA rack was hiding behind the sirens. The K200 was sitting on top. I am a HUGE JBL E fan. I use only E140's and E120's for my PA rig. The weight is a slight issue but who cares? The sight is worth the effort.
Conrad
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Re: Ultimate Kustom T&R Bass Rig? [message #8264 is a reply to message #8263] |
Thu, 15 February 2007 11:05 ![Go to previous message Go to previous message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/up.png) ![Go to next message Go to next message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/down.png) |
C4ster
Messages: 686 Registered: June 2001 Location: Mukwonago, WI (Milwaukee...
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Rather than cobble a K200 looking rig, I just drop a QCS behind the speakers and use the K200 as a preamp. If you are a 15" man, then I must be a Bose man. (Think about that one for a while.)
Conrad
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Re: Ultimate Kustom T&R Bass Rig? [message #8267 is a reply to message #8266] |
Thu, 15 February 2007 14:25 ![Go to previous message Go to previous message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/up.png) ![Go to next message Go to next message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/down.png) |
C4ster
Messages: 686 Registered: June 2001 Location: Mukwonago, WI (Milwaukee...
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I don't think using a slave to increase the power is cheating. No different than having the PA guy line out your amp to the house. Better yet, a good Shure Beta drum mic to get the speaker ambience. I come right out of the speaker output to the power amp in. Keep the level on the K200 at 9:00 and set your volume with the slave. The line out is VERY low level.
Dead serious request. If you happen to run across a Red K100 in good to very good condition, hell player condition even, let me know. I would run down there and grab it. So far I need red, silver and black to complete the K100 Kollection. Black is easy, silver shows up every once in a while, but red,never! I would consider silver if it is available.
Conrad
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Re: Ultimate Kustom T&R Bass Rig? [message #8269 is a reply to message #8267] |
Thu, 15 February 2007 14:54 ![Go to previous message Go to previous message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/up.png) ![Go to next message Go to next message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/down.png) |
daveobergoenner@gmail.com
Messages: 104 Registered: January 2007 Location: Missouri
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I'll keep my eye out for one during my speaker cab search.
Do you want just a K100 red-head, or the whole thing?
Dave O.
Dave 0 Wall-O-Bass
Webpage - <a href="http://webpages.charter.net/daveobieone/" target="_blank">http://webpages.charter.net/daveobieone/</a >
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Re: Ultimate Kustom T&R Bass Rig? [message #8270 is a reply to message #8269] |
Thu, 15 February 2007 16:13 ![Go to previous message Go to previous message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/up.png) ![Go to next message Go to next message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/down.png) |
C4ster
Messages: 686 Registered: June 2001 Location: Mukwonago, WI (Milwaukee...
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The whole thing preferred. I guess if I have to assemble it, that would OK. The prices on Ebay get way out of hand sometimes. Thanks.
Conrad
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Re: Ultimate Kustom T&R Bass Rig? [message #8272 is a reply to message #8271] |
Fri, 16 February 2007 08:21 ![Go to previous message Go to previous message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/up.png) ![Go to next message Go to next message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/down.png) |
C4ster
Messages: 686 Registered: June 2001 Location: Mukwonago, WI (Milwaukee...
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No, I'm talking the original 8 4" speaker cabinet on a stick. Smaller speakers but more of them. What a stupid concept!
Conrad
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Re: Ultimate Kustom T&R Bass Rig? [message #8290 is a reply to message #8289] |
Tue, 20 February 2007 09:01 ![Go to previous message Go to previous message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/up.png) ![Go to next message Go to next message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/down.png) |
daveobergoenner@gmail.com
Messages: 104 Registered: January 2007 Location: Missouri
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Good to know there’s another Kustom fan not too far away!
I’ll report back after I get the second cabinet loaded with these E140’s.
BTW, what version of the Altec 421 do you suggest?
I’ve been wanting to upgrade the CTS speaker in my Ampeg B-15n. I think some version of the 421 was offered by Ampeg as the “upgrade” speaker in that amp, but no one has ever been able to tell me which version. I was thinking the 421A might be the one...but I’m not really sure.
Just did the reverb upgrade in my K200 head over the weekend. I’ll post the details of that in another post however. I can tell you, it’s quite an improvement.
Dave O.
Dave 0 Wall-O-Bass
Webpage - <a href="http://webpages.charter.net/daveobieone/" target="_blank">http://webpages.charter.net/daveobieone/</a >
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Re: Ultimate Kustom T&R Bass Rig? [message #8293 is a reply to message #8292] |
Tue, 20 February 2007 13:35 ![Go to previous message Go to previous message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/up.png) ![Go to next message Go to next message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/down.png) |
C4ster
Messages: 686 Registered: June 2001 Location: Mukwonago, WI (Milwaukee...
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The E140's are copper edge wound voice coils that can handle 200 watts RMS. I routinely drive the 4 I use, wired in parallel for 2 ohms pushed by 1/2 of a PLX 3402 at 1700 watts. Thats 425 for each speaker with great results. That is for PA use but 2X rated RMS power is a typical rating. The only problem I had, was a music passage that I was running through the PA had a low sine wave frequency as part of the music and I was pushing about 1100 watts for the pair and by the time I got to the board to reduce the volume, it was too late. They were fried. OOPS! I found a great speaker parts store in Florida that sells JBL aftermarket kits for $69.00. They are more work than genuine JBL drop in kits but for half the cost. The speakers sound as good as the originals.
Conrad.
PS I am in the Milwaukee Area
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Re: Ultimate Kustom T&R Bass Rig? [message #8294 is a reply to message #8293] |
Tue, 20 February 2007 14:13 ![Go to previous message Go to previous message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/up.png) ![Go to next message Go to next message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/down.png) |
daveobergoenner@gmail.com
Messages: 104 Registered: January 2007 Location: Missouri
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Thanks for solving the Ampeg Altec mystery for me Steve!
I spoke with a fella who does re-cones last week about the Altec 421’s. He said the re-cone kit for the 421A was no longer available...at least from Altec. Might have been feeding me a line...I don’t know.
He said they use the 421LF kit...which I don’t think has nearly the same TS parameters as the A version. He also said the frame was the same for all the 421’s...so any 421 could become any one of them with the right re-cone kit. The guy seems like he used to work for Altec...so I guess he should know.
My B-15n puts out right at 40 watts at clipping into 8 ohms BTW. Guess that’s why James Jamerson went to his Kustom K200 for live gigs. I can’t imagine using a B-15 for a live gig...unless you like a lot of clipping.
Sounds like I won’t be frying any E140’s...even with that MC-2100. I’ve never really pushed them to the limit...but it sure sounds like Conrad has!
I did try an E140 in my Ampeg BTW, but I really didn’t like the sound much. It was much louder than the CTS, but it just didn’t sound very good. I also had to double the gasket thickness, because the JBL cone was bumping into the baffle board on low notes.
Dave O.
Dave 0 Wall-O-Bass
Webpage - <a href="http://webpages.charter.net/daveobieone/" target="_blank">http://webpages.charter.net/daveobieone/</a >
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Re: Ultimate Kustom T&R Bass Rig? [message #8295 is a reply to message #8294] |
Tue, 20 February 2007 14:45 ![Go to previous message Go to previous message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/up.png) ![Go to next message Go to next message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/down.png) |
C4ster
Messages: 686 Registered: June 2001 Location: Mukwonago, WI (Milwaukee...
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My brother, who also posts here on occasion, has 2 red 2x15 with JBL D140's and a K200B1. He absolutely loves the depth he get with that rig. He has 1 8 ohm cabinet and 1 4 ohm cabinet. He uses the 4 ohm most of the time and uses the extra power from the K200. He does like 4 15's though on some occasions but I'm not sure if he has a second head or just runs them both. Maybe if he sees this, he will jump in.
I can really push the E140's hard. I will do an entire stage through the PA. It is really fun to see if I can rumble the floor with the bass guitar. I usually line out the bass and then add more bass from the board. It really gets intense with a 5 string.
Conrad
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Re: Ultimate Kustom T&R Bass Rig? [message #8302 is a reply to message #8301] |
Wed, 21 February 2007 11:17 ![Go to previous message Go to previous message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/up.png) ![Go to next message Go to next message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/down.png) |
daveobergoenner@gmail.com
Messages: 104 Registered: January 2007 Location: Missouri
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BTW, the guy also needs to be careful about the position of that mic.
You don't want it right on the grill cloth, in front of one of the drivers, or stuck right in front of the port. The frequencies coming out of the driver, and the port will be quite different...and you need to pick-up BOTH of them.
Usually, the closest distance that will work is about 12-18 inches, with the mic spaced evenly between the port and the driver.
Also (in most cases) you should make sure he puts a windscreen on the mic. The puffs of air coming out of the port sometimes can really make some odd sounds to the mic.
If it were me, I'd just carry my own mic, and set the position myself.
Dave O.
Dave 0 Wall-O-Bass
Webpage - <a href="http://webpages.charter.net/daveobieone/" target="_blank">http://webpages.charter.net/daveobieone/</a >
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Re: Ultimate Kustom T&R Bass Rig? [message #8307 is a reply to message #8306] |
Thu, 22 February 2007 09:04 ![Go to previous message Go to previous message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/up.png) ![Go to next message Go to next message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/down.png) |
C4ster
Messages: 686 Registered: June 2001 Location: Mukwonago, WI (Milwaukee...
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Yes, I have used drop in JBL recone kits and the Simply Speakers kits are a dead match for the voice coil and cone material. Actually, everything is identical. The only problem is the time it takes to assemble the parts and get a good fit. It isn't hard, just takes patience.
Conrad
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Re: Ultimate Kustom T&R Bass Rig? [message #8309 is a reply to message #8308] |
Thu, 22 February 2007 13:19 ![Go to previous message Go to previous message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/up.png) ![Go to next message Go to next message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/down.png) |
C4ster
Messages: 686 Registered: June 2001 Location: Mukwonago, WI (Milwaukee...
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Absolutely. You can even call them and talk to the owners. I have had a couple of conversations about speakers they don't list in the recone section. They set me up with all the parts for old JBL 122A speakers. They worked perfectly. I would recommend them highly. http://www.simplyspeakers.com/
Conrad
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Re: Ultimate Kustom T&R Bass Rig? [message #8373 is a reply to message #8372] |
Sat, 10 March 2007 10:01 ![Go to previous message Go to previous message](/FUDforum/theme/vk30/images/up.png) |
daveobergoenner@gmail.com
Messages: 104 Registered: January 2007 Location: Missouri
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Just wondering, do you mean you are driving the Kustom 3x15 cabinet with the Peavy head?
Be careful...wouldn't wanna damage those nice old CTS drivers!
What's wrong with the K200 head? Just about anything on them can be fixed BTW.
Dave O.
Dave 0 Wall-O-Bass
Webpage - <a href="http://webpages.charter.net/daveobieone/" target="_blank">http://webpages.charter.net/daveobieone/</a >
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