| Forgerty amp head [message #9319] |
Mon, 17 March 2008 04:25  |
QModer
Messages: 413
Registered: June 2003
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Senior Member |
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I have a few Kustom's in my collection and have seen quite a few Kustom amps. But I have never seen a so called Forgerty amp head. From what I understand its just a standard Kustom 200 lead amp head with what Kustom calls a Harmonic clipper control in it. Is that correct?
If so is this add on in the same effects channel with the reverb, tremelo, and vibrato? And Are these heads still in the A catagory with the Kustom by Ross inc or are they in the later((200)) series marking on the front underneath the on off switch of the Kustom Electronics phase?
Thanks fellas for any help in these for me murky waters.
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| Re: Forgerty amp head [message #9326 is a reply to message #9324] |
Tue, 18 March 2008 10:17  |
QModer
Messages: 413
Registered: June 2003
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Senior Member |
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Well fella's I have found just these two responses to be very interesting and revealing. I of course have some of the old albums and have pondered the pictures many times.
Some of the things that I have learned here is that; At first I thought (many moons ago) that those must be Pa heads with all of the knobs arranged that way.
Another big misconception was that I didn't know why he had two heads together there on the same cab. I thought perhaps one was a spare. I have some 68 amps and they have the purple lights so that must have been a gradual fade in move by Bud. Thats why in the old pic's I thought that the red power lights must have been some kind of effect caused by the camera's of the time like red eye.
That makes sense though if he wanted to just be louder especially at places like the Woodstock festival.
I had also wondered if the harmonic clipper was in fact on the right side and was in a seperate channel as well from the reverb and trem. Since there was not any channel switching in those days.
I also knew that Forgerty had on occasion used the tremelo at what sounded like the same time as the clipper was on unless he was using a fuzz face or some simular pedal that was available at the time.
I have a lead Kustom that is a Ross amp. Its cab is rather odd in that it has 2x10 and 2x12 configeration altogether in the same cab. I played bass way back when in one band where a fella had a simular cab. The drummer from that band and I still talk a lot.
Some times its hard to convience him that my amp is not the same one as the other lead players old amp. But that amp had a one eye in the top. That is one speaker had a chrome cone cover and the other one didn't. He blew out speakers quite often in it (back then Kustom dealers gave new ones away free) and the last time he blew one they put in one with a paper cone. I bought mine brand new a year. Mine is different from his too in that mine has a Ross head with a Kustom Electronics cab. Weird things happen I guess when they get to dealers.
Since he doesn't have his anymore and doesn't even much remember it I think that he didn't have the clipper and the drummer thinks that he did. I think that he didn't because every time he got a new effect he left it on all of the time. He got a fuzz face back at that time and would leave it on until the battery gave out LOL.. Sounds crazy I know but he's got and auto wa now so imagine that. I was just thinking that if he had the clipper he wouldn't need a a fuzz face.
Anyway I finally saw a pic of one these heads and it looked just like Steven said. I was wondered of course if it was real or not as the clipper was on the opposite side from the other effects. That had me thinking was that some kinda misprint or what.
So Steven did he run into one channel and jump a cord to the next one off of it or did he use a Y cord? Then how did he run from there to the other amp?
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| Re: Forgerty amp head [message #9327 is a reply to message #9319] |
Tue, 18 March 2008 12:48 |
norwegian
Messages: 10
Registered: October 2007
Location: Norway
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Junior Member |
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Hi again.
I am only 26 years old but i have been studying Fogerty since I was 14. Stevem knows more about the technical part, but I am sure that Fogerty did not use any fuzz pedal beside the Kustom (live). Only the harmonic clipper. The proof can you see on this [url= picture:http://www.creedence-online.net/photo_gallery/displa yimage-4-13.
I am almost sure that the reason he had two amp heads, was that one of them was a backup amp if there was something wrong with one of them. So he used only one out of two(i am only able to see one red light that is shining on the amp.
He used harmonica and guitar on the same amp. Everything is conditionally, but that is mine conclusion. Sorry my bad english. This is very interresting.
ps: I am going to the fogerty concert in albert hall in london in june! My third concert whith Fogerty.
Dag Rune
Larvik, Norway
[Updated on: Tue, 18 March 2008 12:52] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Forgerty amp head [message #9329 is a reply to message #9327] |
Wed, 19 March 2008 01:34 |
QModer
Messages: 413
Registered: June 2003
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Senior Member |
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I see no problem with your english my friend. Yes this is and interesting discussion. CCR is one of Kustom's biggest all star band user's ever.
I found it interesting that John used a Ric with his. I've got a Ric 360 and get pretty good conviencing tube like sounds from mine au natural as mine doesn't have the Clipper. Its easier to do with the 100 of course than the 200 as the 200 gets pretty loud for most places these days.
The link didn't work for me. I don't know why? Its got good red color tone and thats usually the ones that work correctly.
Glad to hear your comments fron Norway.
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| Re: Forgerty amp head [message #9336 is a reply to message #9332] |
Wed, 19 March 2008 18:08 |
chicagobill
Messages: 2006
Registered: April 2003
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Senior Member |
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I too believe that his was an K200A-4.
If you read the Guitar Player interview this month, JF talks about setting the trem-vibrato knob at some midpoint for his sound. So it must have an either/or control like the SC series had.
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| Re: Forgerty amp head [message #9338 is a reply to message #9332] |
Thu, 20 March 2008 06:02 |
QModer
Messages: 413
Registered: June 2003
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Senior Member |
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Hi ya BC. My Ross black head has vibrato and tremelo. It came with a Purple light. The 3x15's Ross head that I have had a Purple light too. But I didn't buy the 3x15 amp brand new so the orginal owner may have put the purple amp jewel in. I put a white one in it myself LOL..
The link worked this time. Thanks Nowegian. It looks like he is just using the clipper channel only in the photo's. The curly cord makes that pretty obvious.
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| Re: Forgerty amp head [message #9340 is a reply to message #9336] |
Fri, 21 March 2008 07:46 |
QModer
Messages: 413
Registered: June 2003
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Senior Member |
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I'll have to walk in Walmart and sneak a peak at that one.
You can clearly hear the trem on Born On The Bayou. He may have not used it for the show in the pictures on the link live though. I can't see a jumper cord.
I don't know about you fella's but I always plug in the low input. But no matter which one you used if you jumpered the channels with out using a Y cord then one of the jumps would be a high to high or high to low. I'm not sure how that would sound. Maybe I'll try it some time.
I have never used a Y cord on my Kustom channels. Back in the old days I used to run two Kustom's together occasionally when I was playing bass to get more volume. But most of latter day usage of two Kustom amps has been with and A/B switch or one of the stereo outs of one of my pedals. Some of my later Kustom's Electronics heads have a monitor and record out on the back that could be used to run two amps at the same time.
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| Re: Forgerty amp head [message #9341 is a reply to message #9338] |
Fri, 21 March 2008 11:23 |
C4ster
Messages: 686
Registered: June 2001
Location: Mukwonago, WI (Milwaukee...
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Senior Member |
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I'm a little pis**d. I wrote a LONNNNG response only to have function.preg-match screw it up. Can't someone fix that???
OK here goes again. In '85 or '87 I attended the Full Moon Swamp tour. JF played most of his CCR hits and I forget if he had permission to use them at that time. The first song was "Born on the Bayou". Well, during the show, his roadies rolled out his Kustom stack and a red Ric 325. There was only a guitar cord and the 4 button foot switch. He played "Suzie Q" and "I Out a Spell On You" His use of feedback, tremolo(vibrato?), and harmonic clipper was outstanding. View http://youtube.com/watch?v=DT7MNwx4el0 and http://youtube.com/watch?v=dOjla3hOUSg. This was filmed in 1997 but just before "Suzie Q" he explained that the amp was with him on his and I quote "my very first hit record". The K200A4 had a 4 button footswitch, and a 4 pin XLR connector on the rear of the amp. All the effects could be used at any time. A K200B4 had 2 footswitch jacks that replaced 2 knobs on the front of the amp. There were 2 separate footswitches, 1 for each side. The 2 button footswitch was the same as used by the K100-2 and combos. You could only use the effects that were on the side you were plugged in to. The other thing was that on the early CCR pictures and videos, the speakers were JBL D130's with alumunum domes. In the above videos, the speakers were either replaced or more likely, reconed without the aluminum domes. The rating of the D130 is 150 watts RMS and a 100 watt Kustom could hardly touch the 300 watt rating of the cabinet. More likely, age took its toll.
Conrad in South Africa.
Same Conrad, temporary location.
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| Re: Forgerty amp head [message #9347 is a reply to message #9341] |
Sun, 23 March 2008 00:59 |
QModer
Messages: 413
Registered: June 2003
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Senior Member |
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Probably didn't have permission yet. But hey he is Forgerty.
I am a bit surprized though that the B-5 head is retro grade when compared to the A-5. But some strange things have happened over the years I guess. My A lead amp has the same style pin switch foot switch in the back. But its just a reverb, vibrato, and tremelo amp.
I had wondered if the orginal speakers were JBL's or Jensen's with Chrome Domes. Mine are Jensen. I was a bit surprized to find that out when I finally got around to looking LOL..
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| Re: Forgerty amp head [message #9348 is a reply to message #9347] |
Sun, 23 March 2008 04:13 |
C4ster
Messages: 686
Registered: June 2001
Location: Mukwonago, WI (Milwaukee...
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Senior Member |
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JBL domes are slightly over 4.25" in diameter. The Altec and Jensens were smaller. There is a very specific shape to the JBL's that stand out. I'm just an unrepentant JBL fan.
Conrad
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| Re: Forgerty amp head [message #9459 is a reply to message #9319] |
Tue, 06 May 2008 23:02 |
pleat
Messages: 1454
Registered: June 2004
Location: Belding, Mi
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Senior Member |
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Hey guys, pleat here, I haven't been on the site in a very long while. I don't know why but anyway here is a answer to the difference between the K200A4 and K200B4 series amps. The A series amps came out in 67 and the first series had the circuit breakers on the top front panel between the power switch.
The the A series removed the breakers. On the A-4 head all effects worked on the left channel. Harmonic clipper, selective boost, reverb, and True Vibrato and tremolo. The Right side channel was volume, bass, treble, and bright switch. The footswitch was the large round switch with 4 push on push off switches.
It also connected to the back of the amp with a multi-pin switchcraft style XLR plug.
The K200B-4 series came out in late 68. and ran until the K250 slant face amps came in.
On the B4 series amps, the left channel sported reverb and vibrato. The right channel sported selective boost and harmonic clipper.
I never understood why Kustom chose to split the effects on the B seris.Another little fact is the A series used 5 screws to mount the head in the cabinet and the B series used only 4 screws and the head chassic had better supports inside.
The depth of the A series is less that the later B series, so it installing a B series amp into a A series head, the amp will stick out the back of the A series cabinet.
I have heard that JF drove the output from one head into the second head that was connected to the cabinet.
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| Re: Forgerty amp head [message #9492 is a reply to message #9460] |
Sat, 14 June 2008 12:56 |
chicagobill
Messages: 2006
Registered: April 2003
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Senior Member |
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Well I finally got an K200A-4 and so far I love it!
This is a later version without the circuit breakers on the front panel. I've had to replace a couple of bad caps, and I need to find or create a footswitch, but other than that this thing is great. It doesn't quite sound the same as a K200B, but is similar in build.
A few things that I thought I'd mention here are that unlike the B-series amps, none of the FXs work without the footswitch to turn them on. And as Pleat pointed out, the two channels are 1-Normal with no FX at all, and 2-FX with all 4; Reverb, Trem/Vib, Harmonic Clipper and Selective Boost. Instead of the front panel breaker, there is a power fuse mounted on the inside front panel just like a B-series amp, and there is a speaker fuse mounted on the power amp board.
As I play this thing some more, and learn more about it, I'll keep you all informed.
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| Re: Forgerty amp head [message #9495 is a reply to message #9493] |
Sun, 15 June 2008 08:07 |
QModer
Messages: 413
Registered: June 2003
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Senior Member |
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I have and A head too that I have to short at the pins. It got old for me so no reverb, trem, or vib now. If you make that foot switch make me and extra one too LOL..
I have a couple of those old Dallas Arbitor fuzz faces too. One in red and one in blue.
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| Re: Forgerty amp head [message #9497 is a reply to message #9495] |
Mon, 16 June 2008 12:00 |
chicagobill
Messages: 2006
Registered: April 2003
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Senior Member |
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I thought about turning them all on all of the time, but I can't get the clipper to turn "off" from the front panel without turning down the volume.
By the way, the clipper works better if you turn up the main volume control. It is wired into the signal path post-volume control so the louder you play clean, the bigger the signal into the clipper and the distortion is better. This is true of the B-series amps as well.
Q: Just send me one of those Fuzz Faces, and I'll convert it into footswitch for ya!
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